Lolich may have gone 8-13 in 1976 but Koosman did even worse the next two years (1977 and 1978). Peter The fact of the matter is New York is a what have you done for me lately kind of city, and when Lolich came to the Mets he pitched like a nobody. Mickey Lolich did not pitch badly for the Mets in 1976. June 30, 2019 Lolich may have gone 8-13 in 1976 but Koosman did even worse the next two years (1977 and 1978). The Mets acquiring him for Rusty Staub was another trade made by M. Donald Grant out of spite for Staub's salary request. He made the all- star team 3 times, led the AL in wins once, shutouts once, complete games once, innings once, strikeouts once, and losses TWICE.He finished second (1971) and third (1972) in the Cy Young race, and he never finished higher than TENTH PLACE in the league in ERA (finished tenth in both 1971 and 1972).Baseball Reference lists among his top ten in similarity scores: Jerry Koosman, Jerry Reuss, Rick Reuschel, Luis Tiant, Vida Blue, and Joe Niekro.All of that tells me Lolich in his prime was a good pitcher, but nowhere near a HOFer. And yes, maybe Koosman had losing years in the late 70's but he had been a Met long enough with a winning record that the fans rooted for him. Lolich committed to playing 2 years for the Mets, but then reneged on that promise. Within a year, the corpulent Lolich had retired to open a doughnut shop in suburban Detroit. As somebody mentioned previously, this is really all Mike Vail's fault. Lolich was an outstanding pitcher who had just experienced an off season in Detroit. You weren't happy with Rusty and we weren't happy with Lolich, so let's just call the trade a wash. Case closed. Raymond Malcuit Jr. He was overweight and kind of babyfaced but I don't remember anyone being more focused or a battler. When he was with the Mets, I gave him the name "TOO MUCH EATER" but then again the Orange and Blue has always had big boned hurlers (El Sid. April 24, 2003 During those 18 years he autographed thousands of boxes of donuts. His not being elected to Cooperstown is a major oversight. He is an actor, known for The Incredible Melting Man (1977), 1972 American League Championship Series (1972) and 1968 World Series (1968). feat fan Mickey was featured riding his motorcyle. LA-Mets snook In one of his best games as a Met, hefty lefty Lolich (no doubt the prototype for David Wells), tossed 8 innings, allowing 8 hits and 2 walks while striking out 4, the only run scoring on a fourth-inning groundout by a young Dave Parker.Alas, with the Mets historically typical poor run support, Lolich left, trailing 1-0, for pinch hitter Mike Phillips, who fanned for the 2nd out of the ninth, before singles by Ed Kranepool (batting for Leon Brown) and Bruce Boisclair and a walk to John Milner loaded the bases for Joe Torre. I'll take Mickey's pitching line - except for W&L - any time. Ramblin' Pete Only two others, Steve Carlton and Randy Johnson, have surpassed him. Baseball burnt him out. I recall one year where he had 121 RBI's. So when your "inning eater" goes 220 and gets a bonus it's beyond comprehension. C'mon John, the Mets did the Tigers a huge favor by taking this washed-up pitcher off their hands and giving them a great hitter like Rusty. Fact is Lolich was always overweight. In his first full season 1964, Mickey Lolich went 18-9 an ERA of 3.26. He started 45 games and completed 29. Baseball burnt him out. Take a look at his stats on baseball-reference and you will shake your head. Mickey Lolich was the greatest left handed pitcher in the whole world to me in 1968, He was even greater than Denny. Lolich was a good pitcher in his prime - he won 3 games in the '68 Series vs. the Cardinals, including Game 7. No contest. May 8, 2003 He was a big (emphasis: BIG) bust in New York. As a kid collecting baseball cards and watching ballgames in the '70s, I remember being struck by Lolich's belly. The fact of the matter is New York is a what have you done for me lately kind of city, and when Lolich came to the Mets he pitched like a nobody. February 28, 2003 Bob P Lolich finished his career 12th on the all-time strikeout list with 2,832, second only to Steve Carlton among left-handers. Baseball burnt him out. We felt the same way when the Mets traded away Seaver and got back mediocre players for him. That's more realistic but generous, I think! October 19, 2011 Bob Bob P The Mets acquiring him for Rusty Staub was another trade made by M. Donald Grant out of spite for Staub's salary request. But I think the final verdict has to be that neither team would have fared much differently with or without the Lolich/Staub trade. The Staub trade was ridiculous but not Lolich's fault. John, we know the condition the team was in when Lolich got here. My memory is that while the Mets' front office had made dumb and abysmal trades in the past, this was one that just made no sense in any way, shape, or form. A Staub-Kingman combo would have provided more run support for big three, and probably a 90+ win season. So when your "inning eater" goes 220 and gets a bonus it's beyond comprehension. -. End of Line Scrappy Mickey pitched to a poor 8-13 record but he also had a 3.22 ERA which is pretty damn good. After one year in New York Lolich retired. Mickey was a great pitcher but was not happy in New York. While the Detroit Tigers spent the last few days preparing for their first World Series in 16 years, the man who pitched them to the 1968 championship baked more than 10,000 doughnuts. He has been married to Joyce Fleenor since November 21, 1964. (With three lefties and a Seaver, the Mets were lefty killers) But the Mets needed hitting. But I have to say, I laughed out loud when I saw his physical statistics on this site. April 20, 2002 They did not let him pitch the way he wanted. Shari Bob November 19, 2002 And by the time he left Detroit, he was fatter than Lolich. In San Diego they had a fan club for him called the Mickey Lolich Gut Club. But the facts are:Lolich spent 16 years in the Majors. Mickey loved his Harley. That would make him a star in today's market. As somebody mentioned previously, this is really all Mike Vail's fault. How Mickey still had an arm when he pitched for us is amazing. Mickey Lolich is one of my favorite players. (thankfully returning in '81). I guess the idea that everyone loves a jolly fat guy is true. Shickhaus Franks But I have to say, I laughed out loud when I saw his physical statistics on this site. I looked him up in The Sports Encyclopedia 2002 and they have 6' and 210 lbs. Maybe Rusty was not in his prime when the Tigers got him, but the man could still swing the bat. Three bad starts on 8/3 and 8/13 as well as his next to last start on 9/15 is what really bloated his ERA, not that 3.22 even in the '70s was that shabby.Yes, he was far removed from his prime but to say he sucked is pretty short sighted and flies in the face of the fact that he pitched well enough to be a 12-15 game winner, but then this is the same year Seaver pitched Cy Young caliber ball and went only 14-11. Bob They were starting their descent into oblivion and the Staub trade was step in that direction. Scrappy But the facts are:Lolich spent 16 years in the Majors. Mickey Lolich is one of my favorite players. November 3, 2006 August 11, 2015 Lolich may be a legend in Detroit based on his 1968 World Series performance, but he was at the end of his career by 1976. He never had much to say about Lolich's donut shop though. He pitched very good ball for you. I remember Lolich pitching some good ball for the Mets with absolutely NO run support. Jim Snedeker I simply loved to see him walk onto the mound; I knew that we as a ball club would be a winner any time he pitched, but as they always say time moves on, but our memory is always around. In that same year he went 13, 13, 12, 11 and 10 innings in 5 games. His era of 3.22 is only .09% more than 20-game winner Carlton for the Phils. April 23, 2003 April 23, 2003 Three bad starts on 8/3 and 8/13 as well as his next to last start on 9/15 is what really bloated his ERA, not that 3.22 even in the '70s was that shabby.Yes, he was far removed from his prime but to say he sucked is pretty short sighted and flies in the face of the fact that he pitched well enough to be a 12-15 game winner, but then this is the same year Seaver pitched Cy Young caliber ball and went only 14-11. That's more realistic but generous, I think! And yes, maybe Koosman had losing years in the late 70's but he had been a Met long enough with a winning record that the fans rooted for him. Mickey Lolich is one of my favorite players. His not being elected to Cooperstown is a major oversight. March 2, 2003 What a sore disapppointment it was to see Staub take over rightfield (with his gnat's piss arm) after watching Kaline out in right all of those years in Detroit. Or even a platoon as Vail was righty, and Milner was lefty.In the days of 4-man rotation, Seaver-Koosman-Matlack had them covered 75% of the time. I'm still not clear - he traded Mickey Lolich to improve team speed? He later came back to play for the Padres. He started 45 games and completed 29. McLain got all the publicity but Lolich got the wins in post season 1968. In one of his best games as a Met, hefty lefty Lolich (no doubt the prototype for David Wells), tossed 8 innings, allowing 8 hits and 2 walks while striking out 4, the only run scoring on a fourth-inning groundout by a young Dave Parker.Alas, with the Mets historically typical poor run support, Lolich left, trailing 1-0, for pinch hitter Mike Phillips, who fanned for the 2nd out of the ninth, before singles by Ed Kranepool (batting for Leon Brown) and Bruce Boisclair and a walk to John Milner loaded the bases for Joe Torre. He had terrific stuff. There were some games where the Mets did not give him support. December 20, 2019 Let me say that again, 376 and that's without a pitch count. As far as who got the better of the Staub for Lolich deal: Rusty went on to have several excellent seasons in a Tiger uniform. I recall one year where he had 121 RBI's. Too bad we waited until '76 to bring him in, although his numbers indicated a lack of run support. I don't know if Mickey belongs in Cooperstown but he sure deserved more than 25% of the vote which was his highest showing. August 11, 2015 November 19, 2002 What a sore disapppointment it was to see Staub take over rightfield (with his gnat's piss arm) after watching Kaline out in right all of those years in Detroit. However, Mets management, in their infinite wisdom, wanted to trade Rusty Staub so badly, that they were willing to get anything in return, and actually had to go to great lengths to convince Lolich to come to the Mets. Mickey had a lifetime 3.44 ERA and 2832 strikeouts. Mets players and personnel who are no longer with us. March 5, 2006 John Bruce Within a year, the corpulent Lolich had retired to open a doughnut shop in suburban Detroit. After one year in New York Lolich retired. Mickey had a lifetime 3.44 ERA and 2832 strikeouts. April 23, 2003 Bobster1985 As Sonny Jurgenson once said "you don't throw the ball with your stomach." 170 pounds, maybe not but here's a fact: hurled 376 innings in the early 70's. GoMets2006 I'll take Mickey's pitching line - except for W&L - any time. Maybe Rusty was not in his prime when the Tigers got him, but the man could still swing the bat. December 13, 2007 Dianna Jeanneh Jones The last thing the Tigers needed was a dandy hitter whose hitting only went to support lopsided slugfest losses every day. Al Maybe when he was 15 years old he was 170, but at no point in his major league career was he ever 170. Or even a platoon as Vail was righty, and Milner was lefty.In the days of 4-man rotation, Seaver-Koosman-Matlack had them covered 75% of the time. September 24, 2005 He had a 3/4 delivery that thrived on the weight shift. 170 pounds, maybe not but here's a fact: hurled 376 innings in the early 70's. December 8, 2006 6'1", 170???? As far as who got the better of the Staub for Lolich deal: Rusty went on to have several excellent seasons in a Tiger uniform. Man, he was a big one. https://www.nytimes.com/1984/10/09/sports/players-fastballs-to-doughnuts.html. April 6, 2012 I'll start with full disclosure: I was (and still am) bitter that the Mets gave up one of my favorite players, Rusty Staub, to get Lolich-- who was well past his prime. (With three lefties and a Seaver, the Mets were lefty killers) But the Mets needed hitting. Reading this brings back my memory of the trade that sent Rusty packing to Detroit. The point is he made a bad team worse. Robert feat fan Stu Baron Too bad we waited until '76 to bring him in, although his numbers indicated a lack of run support. How Mickey still had an arm when he pitched for us is amazing. The Staub trade was ridiculous but not Lolich's fault. Larry Burns Baseball burnt him out. =Chuck= Five years before he became a Met, Lolich threw for 376 innings! July 15, 2016 I remember that the Daily News at the time would have a one-page section on Sunday that showed some of the athletes with their families away from the ballpark. December 20, 2019 All he represents for me was one of the many horrendous choices the Mets have made over the years, always going after washed up has-beens past their prime. I still remember the Mets broadcast team trying to build him up in the eyes of the fans because he had been a Cy Young award winner. So he went from being the long-time Tiger Ace (and best Tiger- the 1968 World Series was won by him- and also almost the 1972 Playoffs) to just a nobody for New York- can you blame him for this back-stabbing trade by Tiger management? He had a 2.59 ERA at the end of July. Mickey pitched almost 200 innings in 76, gave up less hits than innings and his era was in the low 3.00's. I don't know if Mickey belongs in Cooperstown but he sure deserved more than 25% of the vote which was his highest showing. Maybe Rusty was not in his prime when the Tigers got him, but the man could still swing the bat. Bartolo Colon etc). bogeyman May 6, 2003 No contest. Well, I never realized that Rusty Staub was such a favorite in New York, beside the old Tigers announcer George Kell always making a fuss over Rusty Staub's New York restaurant. Lolich may be a legend in Detroit based on his 1968 World Series performance, but he was at the end of his career by 1976. Bob P (And of course Donald Grant) The Mets had to fill 2 corner outfield spots and first base. Although Mick was not the same pitcher in NY that he was in Detroit, everyone seemed to like the guy. Then Vail hurt his ankle playing Basketball and he was never the same. The two 13-inning games didn't even count for complete games because they went 15 innings! HmmBaseball Reference.com is usually beyond redoubt, but I would say with almost unimpeachable certainty that Mickey Lolich weighed somewhere in the vicinity of 240 by the time he was huffing and puffing his way up the pitchers mound at Shea in 1976.Another awful trade, courtesy of M. Donald Grant, who couldn't wait to run Rusty Staub (coming off a team-record setting 105 RBI season) out of town, weeks after Mrs. Payson passed away. Baseball burnt him out. But in his final season with the Tigers, he became the all-time leader in strikeouts for left-handed pitchers. Mickey Lolich was the greatest left handed pitcher in the whole world to me in 1968, He was even greater than Denny. September 29, 2007 Bobster1985 I'll start with full disclosure: I was (and still am) bitter that the Mets gave up one of my favorite players, Rusty Staub, to get Lolich-- who was well past his prime. Mickey was a fantastic pitcher for the Tigers. Take a look at his stats on baseball-reference and you will shake your head. April 23, 2003 Mickey pitched almost 200 innings in 76, gave up less hits than innings and his era was in the low 3.00's. As somebody mentioned previously, this is really all Mike Vail's fault. Lolich struck out more American League hitters than any other lefty in the history of baseball- that includes Randy Johnson, etc. He had a 3/4 delivery that thrived on the weight shift. April 30, 2009 Mickey Lolich did not pitch badly for the Mets in 1976. Mickey loved his Harley. Within a year, the corpulent Lolich had retired to open a doughnut shop in suburban Detroit. I'll take Mickey's pitching line - except for W&L - any time. He also hit a home run in Game Two of the Series and outpitched Denny "31 Win" McClain in the Series. October 4, 2006 NO WAY he was 170 pounds. October 19, 2011 However, Mets management, in their infinite wisdom, wanted to trade Rusty Staub so badly, that they were willing to get anything in return, and actually had to go to great lengths to convince Lolich to come to the Mets. April 23, 2003 And by the time he left Detroit, he was fatter than Lolich. Take a look at his stats on baseball-reference and you will shake your head. Shickhaus Franks I'll take Mickey's pitching line - except for W&L - any time. June 30, 2019 June 2, 2006 Like Seaver and Koosman, Mickey had pretty meager run support throughout his career. 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